Author Topic: $40 to $50 thousand dollar question  (Read 8992 times)

Offline AirtransRecon

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Re: $40 to $50 thousand dollar question
« Reply #15 on: January 07, 2007, 01:59:10 AM »
Atlanta, Jacksonville, or somewhere else in Florida. I think they have an operation that offers the Airline course at Daytona, if so, then probably there.

KW

Offline chuckar101

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Re: $40 to $50 thousand dollar question
« Reply #16 on: January 07, 2007, 05:38:36 AM »
Sounds fun, if you start soon might see yah when I go on my cross countries.  Either way good luck.
WOW I did that!

Offline stinson6

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Re: $40 to $50 thousand dollar question
« Reply #17 on: January 08, 2007, 08:23:07 PM »
Hello all. This is my first post here and sounds like I'm a little older than most on this subject.  I have been flying since 1987. I have friends who fly commercially for UPS, American, SW, corporate, even Canyon runners. I've done my share of smaller comm gigs too.  So here goes my 2 cents.  If you have a PPL you should go to a 41 school for your Instrument, Comm and CFI.  When you take your Instrument written turn right around and take the CFII written (same test).  Save your money now and don't get the multi unless it's in the package.  After this, get a CFI gig. Remember, most schools will not allow you to instruct in Mult until you have 250 hours of instructing; due to liability insurance.  Once you get in the neighborhood 750 hours then get your Multi CFI.  Now you can spend money on multi time if you're not getting enough with CFI thing. When you end up with 1000 hours then you will be in the hiring zone for corporate aircraft (you'll need about 125 hours multi so anything over 750 with the 125 multi will be close).  You will waste alot of money on so called hiring preferences with the big schools if your goal is corporate.  The reason I say CFI route is corporate aviation is 90% who you know and being in the right place at the right time.  My best friend flew Lear 45's, upgraded to G-200 then the G-IV with his company.  His co-pilots were hired exclusively from word of mouth, friends and friends of friends-pretty standard practice unless your wanting huge companies like 3m etc... I hope this helps. Good luck. Now here is the counterpoint to corporate. First the positives: The equipment is without equal, it's ever changing with your destinations (airline is very standard and can be boring flying the same route for 90 days or as long as you bid that route...), pay is pretty good when you are a captain; 70-100 Lear, Citation, etc.., 100-170 for G-IV, Global express, etc... Now the negative: To put it bluntly, you are the "help." No matter how you slice it you are their "bitch."  Sorry to put it that way but there it is. How blatant is largely who you work for. My buddy works for a great guy who expects him to have the jet ready at a moments notice; catering, rental cars, etc... but isn't too "upity."  He has worked for other however that get out of the car and walk to the jet without even so much as a hello; expects his bags to be placed in the jet and when he is situated with his seat expects them (captain or co-pilot to ask, 'what would you like to drink?" before start up). You are also at their whim.  Remember, its their airplane so when the Boss wants to go to Aspen for Christmas and you are the pilot guess where you get to go?  My buddy's boss will pay for him to fly back commercially if his trips are for holidays...  Goood luck.
« Last Edit: January 08, 2007, 08:29:22 PM by stinson6 »

fireflyr

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Re: $40 to $50 thousand dollar question
« Reply #18 on: January 09, 2007, 04:27:43 AM »
Welcome, good post! ::wave::
Been the "bitch" for a couple of owners--OOPS--I mean employers, don't want to go back.   Young folks in the business are better off going to a large flight department or driving bus  (airlines) airplanes.

undatc

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Re: $40 to $50 thousand dollar question
« Reply #19 on: January 09, 2007, 04:50:05 AM »
Hello all. This is my first post here and sounds like I'm a little older than most on this subject.  I have been flying since 1987. I have friends who fly commercially for UPS, American, SW, corporate, even Canyon runners. I've done my share of smaller comm gigs too.  So here goes my 2 cents.  If you have a PPL you should go to a 41 school for your Instrument, Comm and CFI.  When you take your Instrument written turn right around and take the CFII written (same test).  Save your money now and don't get the multi unless it's in the package.  After this, get a CFI gig. Remember, most schools will not allow you to instruct in Mult until you have 250 hours of instructing; due to liability insurance.  Once you get in the neighborhood 750 hours then get your Multi CFI.  Now you can spend money on multi time if you're not getting enough with CFI thing. When you end up with 1000 hours then you will be in the hiring zone for corporate aircraft (you'll need about 125 hours multi so anything over 750 with the 125 multi will be close).  You will waste alot of money on so called hiring preferences with the big schools if your goal is corporate.  The reason I say CFI route is corporate aviation is 90% who you know and being in the right place at the right time.  My best friend flew Lear 45's, upgraded to G-200 then the G-IV with his company.  His co-pilots were hired exclusively from word of mouth, friends and friends of friends-pretty standard practice unless your wanting huge companies like 3m etc... I hope this helps. Good luck. Now here is the counterpoint to corporate. First the positives: The equipment is without equal, it's ever changing with your destinations (airline is very standard and can be boring flying the same route for 90 days or as long as you bid that route...), pay is pretty good when you are a captain; 70-100 Lear, Citation, etc.., 100-170 for G-IV, Global express, etc... Now the negative: To put it bluntly, you are the "help." No matter how you slice it you are their "bitch."  Sorry to put it that way but there it is. How blatant is largely who you work for. My buddy works for a great guy who expects him to have the jet ready at a moments notice; catering, rental cars, etc... but isn't too "upity."  He has worked for other however that get out of the car and walk to the jet without even so much as a hello; expects his bags to be placed in the jet and when he is situated with his seat expects them (captain or co-pilot to ask, 'what would you like to drink?" before start up). You are also at their whim.  Remember, its their airplane so when the Boss wants to go to Aspen for Christmas and you are the pilot guess where you get to go?  My buddy's boss will pay for him to fly back commercially if his trips are for holidays...  Goood luck.


Good deal.  however take it with a grain of salt.  When i was origionally a commercial major, i want to fly coperate for this reason.  I liked the fact i never knew when, or where i was going.  It the spirit of adventure.  If your boss wants to go to the Bahama's for the weekend, guess where you get to hang out, on his dime not yours.  True, if your a family guy, or if you have a serious relationship, probably not for you, but when your 25 or so, who cares?  Go see some places, experience the world.  With a few thousand hours of time, most majors will pick you up no problem.

Offline TheSoccerMom

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Re: $40 to $50 thousand dollar question
« Reply #20 on: January 09, 2007, 10:24:31 PM »
One drawback is, LOTS of bosses DON'T need to go to the Bahamas, or Aspen, or Jackson Hole....  the job will take you to much less lovely spots....   :-\

Don't get me wrong, a job is a job, and I have always been happy to have one, especially flying, but I did work for one (corporate) place where the biggest priority was making sure that when you exited the stunningly gorgeous aircraft, you wiped your dusty footprints off the special Cordovan-leather steps on the airstair door, because when the bigwigs came back, they did NOT want to see a speck of dust on the airplane.....  it wasn't about flying, it was more like babysitting....

So, even though it all falls under the category of "flying", to me, some jobs are just more worthwhile and rewarding.  Now when I hear the comments about "Where's the ice bucket?" and "Aren't there any cold drinks?" and "Which way to the lavatory?", I can laugh like hell because they're all coming from exhausted guys and gals who were up all night digging fireline and who are so filthy that all I can see is their white teeth grinning through the soot as they give me good-natured grief.     ::loony::

I know, any flying job is good, right?  But, some are more "good" than others, if you ask me.   

Just my 2 cents' worth........   8) 
Don't make me come back there!!!!

fireflyr

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Re: $40 to $50 thousand dollar question
« Reply #21 on: January 10, 2007, 02:41:58 PM »
Exactly right Soccermom, |:)\
I've spent many hours exploring the FBO at  exotic places such as Bakersfield CA or Wells NV, looking for something to eat (like a Rels hot sandwich ::sick::) or just trying to take a nap on a wooden bench while the boss was at a meeting ::knockedout::
I never told my non-flying friends about that, I just let them think it was all fun and games ::whistle::

And since when does a smoke jumper ( ::loony:: these people JUMP OUT of airplanes ::loony::) call the crapper a "lavatory"???
« Last Edit: January 11, 2007, 10:01:23 AM by fireflyr »

Offline TheSoccerMom

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Re: $40 to $50 thousand dollar question
« Reply #22 on: January 11, 2007, 06:15:05 AM »
Tee hee!!

You reminded me, yes, of the glamorous spots on some of these trips...  We spent a long, cold, drafty evening in Butte, MT, once, and there was ONE spot to sit down..  the other pilot and I kept trying to share the seat but the giant crater in the middle where the springs were busted made it so hard not to FALL IN...  we kept switching places and were SO cold and were starving...  we couldn't stop LAUGHING...  our feet were numb from the breeze under the door....  we practically attacked the passengers in JOY when they finally appeared....  ahh, the fun of charters....   ;D

And YES, I had one funny smokejumper who ALWAYS asked where the lav was, where were the cold Pepsis, and what was the inflight MOVIE...  he was hilarious...  he's the same one who would (only in public places if "real" people were around) run up to me when we got a fire call, and would holler in a panicked voice "We gotta go!  Have you seen the PILOT!?!?"  It was so funny.  He loved the confused / angry / huffy looks he got from the poor public bystanders.  One quite-intense woman had just finished telling me (rather vehemently) how GLAD SHE WAS to see a WOMAN PILOT...  then he ran up and said that with a big grin, and, honestly, I thought she was going to slug him.  

He was great entertainment..  but he was also such a parachute expert that he was finally lured away to develop new parachute systems.   I still miss him!!    ;D   

And, there are no crappers or any other amenities, for that matter.......  as you know....  but Hey, that's a whole 'nother thread!!!   :-\
Don't make me come back there!!!!