Author Topic: Construction Helicopters - anyone got inside contacts ?  (Read 3680 times)

Offline Lt.Fubar

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Construction Helicopters - anyone got inside contacts ?
« on: March 02, 2010, 04:46:49 PM »
I was working on Sikorsky S-58JT for Ms Flight Simulator, with the help of Jim Triggs and Stephen Hollands from Midwest Helicopters (great guys) but unfortunately the contact went stagnant, and with limited reference material, I had to put the work on hold temporarily. I see that Construction Helicopters use both the S-58T and S-61L, and was wondering if anyone got an inside contact that I could ask for help.

I have rather bad experience with using official contact methods* - for example Carson and Aris Helicopters didn't even bothered to write back... where a simple "sorry but we're busy at the moment" like I got from few others, would suffice.



*Although guys at Chelton were very helpful, but that was a different story (was researching EFIS equipment for a friend).
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Offline G-man

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Re: Construction Helicopters - anyone got inside contacts ?
« Reply #1 on: March 02, 2010, 05:09:43 PM »
I know a bunch of the construction people----what would you like from them?
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Offline Lt.Fubar

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Re: Construction Helicopters - anyone got inside contacts ?
« Reply #2 on: March 02, 2010, 05:42:40 PM »
With this kind of work I usually need manuals, tons of pictures at weird and commonly useless angles and a lot of insight of the machine work and behavior.

Flight manuals I have (S-58A-D and PT6 retrofit supplement). Would need pictures of details (for example inside of the air intake, or FOD/Ice blow-out duct).
The most amazing materials I got for other helicopters are Training Manuals and Maintenance Manuals (got a ton of those on Ch-47) if I could get my hands on these for S-58 it would be awesome.

A friend of mine will be working on Mi-14PS Haze - a machine I have access to, so I offered him help in collecting materials. So far I have few DVDs of pictures, few scanned publications, and there are Pilot handbooks and maintenance manuals waiting to be scanned for him. And later this week, I'm going to the maintenance guys to take pictures and videos on all the access panels, bolts, rivets and... who knows what. You always have not enough material in this kind of work :D ... And to think this is going to be available for free  ::whistle::
Here's an example of the pictures I took for him of the interior (which cost me 2 weeks in bed on antibiotics  ::silly:: ) :
http://rapidshare.com/files/343081749/Mi-14.exe.html
“I'm a leaf on a wind, watch how I soar.” Hoban 'Wash' Washburne

Offline Frank N. O.

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Re: Construction Helicopters - anyone got inside contacts ?
« Reply #3 on: March 06, 2010, 03:13:44 PM »
Wow, not bad, just too bad it's really difficult for any vehicle-sim builders to get good data, although once in a while someone does take their time to help.

Frank
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Offline Lt.Fubar

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Re: Construction Helicopters - anyone got inside contacts ?
« Reply #4 on: March 06, 2010, 03:58:36 PM »
The toughest part usually is to get a good set of 3-way drawings / blueprints / line drawings. This is usually impossible for most helicopters, only good one's I have, are for Bell 412, and that's only because Bell put their Line drawings into "Product Data" brochure available in pdf on their website (insane !). For example the S-58T I'm working on, was build upon drawings of Westland Wessex, with only an outline of S-58T nose, so the nose on that model IS wrong, and in need of being corrected. If I had personal access to the bird, I would just take a ruler, camera, notepad... and do a set of accurate blueprints myself.

Tried to do it with S-61N using available pictures, but couldn't finish it... I snapped after changing hundreds times position of a single line, as my calculations formulas were constantly off. When it looked like I had CTD I pulled the plug on that project... not worth of all the hair pulled out  ;D

I have a lot of documents on different helicopters - pilots handbooks, maintenance/flight/training manuals. And I love the flight sims, but there is only a handful of good machines there - for FSX there is really only one - the Dodo B206B3, and even though a great piece of modeling and coding - the machine itself have limitations. So if you want something be done right - do it yourself. But there is a problem. The reference materials are usually not good enough, or lacking in some areas.

For example - I have NASA paper on physics modeling of helicopter flight based on Sikorsky S-70 model, great stuff... if you're coding a flight model for simulation - not when you make a machine that is using the existing one. Same in many different areas. So I actually made a spreadsheet to see what I could do, and what I shouldn't. There are 25 machines there, 22 characteristics, the ones that have the highest, have the top places... the first 5 are: Bell 212, Sikorsky S-61A, Bell 412, AW139 and Eurocopter AS365... non of witch I would give my "vote of confidence" as in every one there is something very important lacking. The funny thing is, the S-58T is on place... 16th. So yeah... I need a lot of help on that one.

And no - the Mil Mi-14 is nowhere on that list, because, I have everything needed to do it, including people to flight test it, BUT... it's just to close to my heart to try, as I know it would take me forever, as everything would have to be absolutely perfect, and that's just impossible.
“I'm a leaf on a wind, watch how I soar.” Hoban 'Wash' Washburne