Roost Air Lounge => Aviation related topics => Topic started by: Mike on August 20, 2006, 03:56:40 AM
Title: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: Mike on August 20, 2006, 03:56:40 AM
Hey guys!
Check this out!
You might already know that a lot of our characters are based on people we know. Of course we always get their permission and so far everybody was really excited to become a character. Jason, Captain Ed, Ray, Julio, and even the FAA guys are based on real people. So was Chuck. I will tell you more about the background (IF you guys are even interested...) Of course Chuck is based on my life as well but a lot of Chuck is "inspired" by this guy. His name is....well......Chuck! He was so excited that he had to have this character on his helicopter which we finally did at the Camarillo Airshow today.Check it out!
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: Mike on August 20, 2006, 04:01:12 AM
Of course let me point out that the real Chuck is happily married and usually isn't as awkward around women (much like me as well....... I think...uhm :-[ )
The real Chuck is actually the only certified helicopter aerobatic pilot in the US. You should check him out Sunday on the CMA show and if you miss it, he will also be at the Nellis Airshow and the San Francisco Airshow later this year. As you can probably tell, he flies for Red Bull. Look for him and tell him you're Chicken Wings fan.
More on the show and some CW background later....
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: Frank N. O. on August 20, 2006, 10:07:54 AM
Wow! A real Chuck! But being a certified aerobatic pilot then I'm sure he's not like the chicken Chuck right? But, is there really only one certified helicopter aerobatic pilot in all of USA when there are 3 in Germany?
Thanks for the info, I have to show my brother Michael this (he's visiting atm). Frank
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: spacer on August 20, 2006, 01:44:15 PM
Well, I think the chicken Chuck is a pretty prolific aerobatic pilot, just not on purpose. :D
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: Frank N. O. on August 20, 2006, 02:07:52 PM
Lol good one Velo. Mike is that the pilot with the Bo-105 that was in touch with the german pilot from the Raab in Gefahr clip I showed earlier?
And speaking of helicopter stunts, did you have a clip of that recording of the jets flying right under you where you had problems getting to the planned altitude fast enough with the cameracrew on board at that sports-event?
Frank
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: Mike on August 23, 2006, 05:00:24 AM
Lol good one Velo. Mike is that the pilot with the Bo-105 that was in touch with the german pilot from the Raab in Gefahr clip I showed earlier?
Yeah, it's a funny story really but that guy you see in the video (with the white gloves) is the guy who trained the real Chuck since, like you mentioned, there isn't anybody in the states who can do this.
Let me tell you, the performance was unbelievable. He didn't do all of the crazy things Rainer did on the video but seeing a helicopter do a barrel roll live with my own eyes......AWESOME!!! Not all the spectators really knew that this has never been done before in the states but I made sure I told everybody who stopped by at the booth... ;) (I actually got a free Red Bull for it....wouldn't you know . . . HA HA :D )
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: Mike on August 29, 2006, 11:52:44 PM
Now, you really have to see this live but check out the pic!
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: spacer on August 30, 2006, 02:08:45 AM
That model has a one-piece rotorhead, doesn't it? I'm impressed. I've heard of this but have yet to see it live.
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: Frank N. O. on August 30, 2006, 09:41:10 AM
Awesome! I wonder what a Gazelle can do compared to this, probably not as much though, but I still think it looks better, but then again, like with all forms of vehicles, exterior looks don't make much of a difference if the handling is there :D
Btw, Velo did you see the stream-feed from german tv I linked to in this forum a while ago? The one showing a german reporter/comic/singer who went up with the german guy that Chuck's talked to that actually flew a stunt-sequence from hell in a identical bird? It's a sight to behold and very friendly of the station (Pro7) to allow and host free looks at the clip :D
Frank
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: fireflyr on August 31, 2006, 01:39:53 AM
Was that the one where the dude had to puke ???
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: Mike on August 31, 2006, 05:12:03 AM
That model has a one-piece rotorhead, doesn't it? I'm impressed. I've heard of this but have yet to see it live.
The actual head is milled out of one piece of titanium I have heard, but I'll ask the real Chuck. The rotor head looks almost like a standard fully articulated system with the exception of some weird flyweights.... But I do know that the whole gearbox is mounted verrrrrry rigidly to the frame and has no rubber mounts which makes the aircraft very responsive (must be exciting going in and out of ETL with this one...hehe) Another cool thing is that the blades don't flap much (maybe the rigit munting of the gbx or the rotorspeed) so there is no threat of the blades going through the tailboom....
I'll find out more soon!
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: fireflyr on September 02, 2006, 11:05:46 AM
ETL??? Was is das? ???
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: Frank N. O. on September 02, 2006, 11:25:32 AM
I think so yes, the crazy comic/singer/talk-show host with the beard and the weird hat that didn't work since he didn't understand how aerobatics works.
And about ETL then I'll also ask: Was ist das für ein Ding?
Frank
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: Mike on September 03, 2006, 06:51:38 PM
ETL ??
It's a rotor-wing aerodynamics thing that happens when transitioning into forward flight and when going back into a hover....
Stands for: Effective Translational Lift
But you guys knew that, right?! ;)
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: fireflyr on September 04, 2006, 05:30:52 AM
It's a rotor-wing aerodynamics thing that happens when transitioning into forward flight and when going back into a hover....
Stands for: Effective Translational Lift
But you guys knew that, right?! ;)
Not really--it's something you don't need when your wing-thingys move at the same speed as the fuselage ;)
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: Mike on September 04, 2006, 04:14:01 PM
Yeah, there are a bunch of aerodynamic phenomea happening when a helicopter transitions from a hover into forward flight. The disc gets more lift, etc. etc. But without going too much into that, one thing that happens is a vibration which you usually feel more with rigid rotor systems and when the gearbox is mounted fairly rigid to the frame. The Astars and Jet Rangers have rubber mounts which the gearbox sits on. On the BO 105 where everything is tied to the airframe as tight as possible with no give I am sure you will feel the ETL vibration a lot more pronounced....
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: fireflyr on September 04, 2006, 04:25:00 PM
Can ETL cause any problems?
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: Mike on September 05, 2006, 05:50:08 AM
No, not really. Part of it is the vortices that are at the blade tips (just like wingtips) which in a hover "surround" the helicopter in a hover. When you move into forward flight they get "blown" towards the back and move through the airframe as they do that which causes a vibration. Then there are a few aerodynamic things, i.a. lift and angle of attack changes, which will have an effect on the blade and therefore the gearbox it is essentiallly attached to. If I get some extra time one of these days I'll try to explain it in more detail.
But it's pretty much "normal" for every helicopter....
Like the fat back kid says in the "Me, myself, and Irene" movie: "How hard can it be? It's just lift versus drag and rotation!" :D :D :D (one of the most stupid movie line EVER!!!!!)
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: Mike on November 16, 2006, 05:45:41 AM
So, the Red Bull helicopter has been repainted. . .
BUT:
It again got that really important addition !!!!! not bad, huh?!?!
Did anybody see the show at the Nellis AFB ?? Apparently the real Chuck outdid himself this time . . .
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: Mike on December 23, 2006, 03:32:15 AM
Check out what Chuck is up to for Christmas:
http://www.flyingbulls.at/xmas/xmas06-1.html
you have to double-click on the "packages" when the animation pauses.... (oh, and the show might want you to close the forum, just do it, no big deal....)
::wave:: Merry Christmas!
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: Frank N. O. on December 23, 2006, 04:52:06 AM
Lol, nice little thing, thanks for sharing the link :)
Also found some helicopter info on the BO from the website that follows, and that they have a Cobra helicopter! :o Chuck is cool, if we get the Focus then I got just the spot for a Capt. Chuck sticker under the Focus logo on the left of the big trunk, if only I could get one sent over.
Frank
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: undatc on December 26, 2006, 11:44:13 AM
I know I asked awhile ago in another thread, but I think it got missed by Mike or whoever knows...
Why is it such a big thing for helo's to go inverted, or do barrel rolls? I know the Apache was the first to be able to, but hadnt heard of other ones that could, till now. I understand the principal of how planes do it, angle of attack and chamber, isnt it the same, and as you can control the pitch of your blades, shouldn't it actually be easier for you to do it? Given all of the controls would be reversed, i think....
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: Baradium on December 26, 2006, 10:04:00 PM
I know I asked awhile ago in another thread, but I think it got missed by Mike or whoever knows...
Why is it such a big thing for helo's to go inverted, or do barrel rolls? I know the Apache was the first to be able to, but hadnt heard of other ones that could, till now. I understand the principal of how planes do it, angle of attack and chamber, isnt it the same, and as you can control the pitch of your blades, shouldn't it actually be easier for you to do it? Given all of the controls would be reversed, i think....
Without having any actual first hand experience... all that torque is going through that little (albiet strong) rotor shaft, that's a lot of stress to be asking. Additionally, instead of being close to in line to the CG like with an aircraft, the rotors are *above* the CG in a helo. This will require much more power to overcome, and then you have all the lift created well below the CG (read: less stable than before!)
I think it's a torque issue (rotationally about the axis) that gets choppers in going inverted. It just takes so much torque to get the CG to go above the rotor blades...
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: Mike on December 27, 2006, 10:22:02 AM
I know I asked awhile ago in another thread, but I think it got missed by Mike or whoever knows...
Why is it such a big thing for helo's to go inverted, or do barrel rolls? I know the Apache was the first to be able to, but hadnt heard of other ones that could, till now. I understand the principal of how planes do it, angle of attack and chamber, isnt it the same, and as you can control the pitch of your blades, shouldn't it actually be easier for you to do it? Given all of the controls would be reversed, i think....
Let me try to answer this as best as I can. Rotors are usually designed only for positive loads. It is actually possible to do a flip in a bunch of helicopters (I say "a flip" because it's not really a loop, the helo rolls and then just falls through until it hopefully rights itself before hitting the ground). But you couldn't hover upside down like in a RC helo because you would need to reverse your collective to pitch the blades down instead of up. In my aircraft (Panaca Jane) the problem would be the hydraulics. They would lock up during such a maneuver because they were not designed for those high loads (experts call it "servo transparency"). On most of the others I would simply be afraid of my blades touching my airframe at one point or another during the maneuver. The BO 105 is designed with a very rigid rotorhead and the gearbox is attached by mounting it directly to the airframe. In most helicopters, the gbx is mounted on elastomeric bearings for a little give and a smoother ride and the blades usually like to flap more.... There are other things as well, low G considerations for example where in a 2 bladed system you could break the mast and have the rotor depart the airframe and so on...
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: undatc on December 27, 2006, 05:41:02 PM
I know I asked awhile ago in another thread, but I think it got missed by Mike or whoever knows...
Why is it such a big thing for helo's to go inverted, or do barrel rolls? I know the Apache was the first to be able to, but hadnt heard of other ones that could, till now. I understand the principal of how planes do it, angle of attack and chamber, isnt it the same, and as you can control the pitch of your blades, shouldn't it actually be easier for you to do it? Given all of the controls would be reversed, i think....
Let me try to answer this as best as I can. Rotors are usually designed only for positive loads. It is actually possible to do a flip in a bunch of helicopters (I say "a flip" because it's not really a loop, the helo rolls and then just falls through until it hopefully rights itself before hitting the ground). But you couldn't hover upside down like in a RC helo because you would need to reverse your collective to pitch the blades down instead of up. In my aircraft (Panaca Jane) the problem would be the hydraulics. They would lock up during such a maneuver because they were not designed for those high loads (experts call it "servo transparency"). On most of the others I would simply be afraid of my blades touching my airframe at one point or another during the maneuver. The BO 105 is designed with a very rigid rotorhead and the gearbox is attached by mounting it directly to the airframe. In most helicopters, the gbx is mounted on elastomeric bearings for a little give and a smoother ride and the blades usually like to flap more.... There are other things as well, low G considerations for example where in a 2 bladed system you could break the mast and have the rotor depart the airframe and so on...
So then, wouldnt it simply be a matter of making a system that allowed more adjustability for pitch in the blades (upwards and downwards), making the rotarhead further away, stronger, and with a more powerful engine. Hmmmm, shouldnt be to hard.....
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: Mike on December 27, 2006, 06:21:51 PM
Oh yeah...definetly!
All you would have to do is design a new gearbox, a special rotor head, stiffer blades, a new airframe which can take these new loads, a fuelsystem and engine that can run upside down, find out how to reverse the cyclic and make it go down as well instead of just up, of course add more powerful hydraulics, ground test it, flight test it, train pilots, get it approved . . hmmm ::thinking::
can't be that hard... I mean especially since it's been done before with the RC helos heh heh . . .
Maybe Chuck and Julio can come up with something.... ;)
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: Panzerrat on December 28, 2006, 01:25:47 AM
Even if you designed the helioflipter they way you mention, wouldn't rolling 'er onto her back be a real "Mother!" event?
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: undatc on December 28, 2006, 02:47:41 AM
ah hell, if we can deep fry ice cream, and make a ski slope in kuwait, we can build us a chopper that can do it.
Title: Re: Camarillo Airshow!
Post by: fireflyr on December 28, 2006, 02:50:01 AM
